Comments on: Another scream on Flash, Alchemy Memory and compilers. http://unitzeroone.com/blog/2009/05/22/another-scream-on-flash-alchemy-memory-and-compilers/ by Ralph Hauwert, Creative Developer, Consultant Sat, 21 Jan 2012 14:58:06 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: Alchemy 와 속도 | Blog http://unitzeroone.com/blog/2009/05/22/another-scream-on-flash-alchemy-memory-and-compilers/#comment-3155 Alchemy 와 속도 | Blog Sat, 19 Nov 2011 19:19:18 +0000 http://www.unitzeroone.com/blog/?p=221#comment-3155 [...] 읽고 쓸때 마다 inline assembler를 사용해야 하는 불편이 따른다. 그렇지 않고 UnitZeroOne의 글 처럼 편리를 위해 inline assembler를 Wrap 하는 함수를 만들어 사용한다면 [...] [...] 읽고 쓸때 마다 inline assembler를 사용해야 하는 불편이 따른다. 그렇지 않고 UnitZeroOne의 글 처럼 편리를 위해 inline assembler를 Wrap 하는 함수를 만들어 사용한다면 [...]

]]> By: Michael Lueftenegger http://unitzeroone.com/blog/2009/05/22/another-scream-on-flash-alchemy-memory-and-compilers/#comment-694 Michael Lueftenegger Sun, 28 Feb 2010 14:47:49 +0000 http://www.unitzeroone.com/blog/?p=221#comment-694 Hi! Great Post! Very informative. What about a post compiler that parses the swf file and replaces the call of the writeByte wrapper with the bytecode? Additionally it could do some optimizations like inlineing math functions. michael Hi!

Great Post! Very informative.

What about a post compiler that parses the swf file and replaces the call of the writeByte wrapper with the bytecode? Additionally it could do some optimizations like inlineing math functions.

michael

]]> By: Adobe Alchemy 资料整理 « 国士无双 http://unitzeroone.com/blog/2009/05/22/another-scream-on-flash-alchemy-memory-and-compilers/#comment-693 Adobe Alchemy 资料整理 « 国士无双 Sat, 23 Jan 2010 06:39:00 +0000 http://www.unitzeroone.com/blog/?p=221#comment-693 [...] 10, Massive amounts of 3D particles with Alchemy More play with Alchemy: Lookup table effects Another scream on Flash, Alchemy Memory and compilers Alchemy plasma experiment （这个例子入门不错） Using an Alchemy generated texture on a 3D [...] [...] 10, Massive amounts of 3D particles with Alchemy More play with Alchemy: Lookup table effects Another scream on Flash, Alchemy Memory and compilers Alchemy plasma experiment （这个例子入门不错） Using an Alchemy generated texture on a 3D [...]

]]> By: dbam http://unitzeroone.com/blog/2009/05/22/another-scream-on-flash-alchemy-memory-and-compilers/#comment-692 dbam Sat, 12 Sep 2009 10:32:46 +0000 http://www.unitzeroone.com/blog/?p=221#comment-692 i was wondering... When You say : "...Compc, which is used for actionscript project compilation isn't compatible with this special asc.jar. Not too worry, we can get around this, more on that later..." i have the feeling that You never get to that point. Or do i miss something? I'm reading the post over and over again, but can't connect the spots. Could You pin-point that step? Is it that AIR application of Yours (parsing output swf byte-by-byte and changing the proper values?) What language is that pseudo, AS3-lookin', __asm-containing API? I'm working on a project, heavy memory reading-writing involved. I use Flex CL compiler to compile my .SWFs, but would love to get the most out of AVM2 ( even if this means to get hands dirty with alchemy ). Looks like a looong road ahead... Cheers, the-bam i was wondering…
When You say :
“…Compc, which is used for actionscript project compilation isn’t compatible with this special asc.jar. Not too worry, we can get around this, more on that later…”
i have the feeling that You never get to that point.
Or do i miss something? I’m reading the post over and over again, but can’t connect the spots.
Could You pin-point that step?
Is it that AIR application of Yours (parsing output swf byte-by-byte and changing the proper values?)
What language is that pseudo, AS3-lookin’, __asm-containing API?

I’m working on a project, heavy memory reading-writing involved. I use Flex CL compiler to compile my .SWFs, but would love to get the most out of AVM2 ( even if this means to get hands dirty with alchemy ).

Looks like a looong road ahead…
Cheers,
the-bam

]]> By: devu http://unitzeroone.com/blog/2009/05/22/another-scream-on-flash-alchemy-memory-and-compilers/#comment-691 devu Wed, 02 Sep 2009 15:48:07 +0000 http://www.unitzeroone.com/blog/?p=221#comment-691 So true and sad sometimes... but I am wondering about one thing. (On the beginning I am sorry for my English and I am not a French ;) ) One man - Nicolas could develop such a big platform or solution able to deal with swf format more eficient way. Now we see clearly the point the swf and AVM2 with all of limitation is the key. Have you thing about what culd happend to the AS3 developers or even designers if any other competitor (SL JavaFX) on this market could really provide better solution? GPU acceleration, clear and easy Drawing API with GPU as well, multi threading and efficiency close to the cpp and finally designer/developer-friendly IDE... it would be disaster for Flash platform and huge leak of talented guys. Because Macromedia/Adobe itself learned us from 10 years how to do better and better stuff. A lot of guys become developers even if they started from designer background only. Thanks to this technology and fact that because designer and developer worlds could met in one place. Is anyone here thinking that designers are going to work so close with pure cpp development as with Flash could do? Whatever it is, game, website, application. However we still need more because as we can follow the Flash features flash could follow the technology trends around. But in the same time keep it simple and intuitive for us. Fortunately or not, nor of competitors could change our way ... yet. But as we know SL did big storm on this sea few years ago. Think about different scenario. Don't you thing if someone like Nicolas could develop brand new solution as a platform with this whole stuff above in mind and target to Flash Developers/ Designers? Make it more elegant, efficient and just have a chance avoid all of these bad experience and disappointments in the middle? Is it so difficult? We need another 10 years to promote brand new file extension? Personally I don't think so. And guy like Nicolas just inspired me to thing this way. 10 years ago was few guys around to play with flash 5. Now we are talking about potentially more than 1milion active development community. If they'll got something more robust to deal with it will take few months to do revolution and news about this will spread the world as quick as client will be able to pay for new version of Quake on-line with GPU support. And as easy as you can do any stuff in AS3 or haXe. My conclusion is technology and standards are belong to us, developers who can follow or not the trends. If you think is not like that just go backwards 10 years and think what you though about many things, how many technologies died because no one picked it up. Only big companies job is to make you believe is only one way and cover-up the core of the invention. Sometimes is worth to reinvent the wheel. So true and sad sometimes… but I am wondering about one thing.
(On the beginning I am sorry for my English and I am not a French ;) )

One man – Nicolas could develop such a big platform or solution able to deal with swf format more eficient way.
Now we see clearly the point the swf and AVM2 with all of limitation is the key. Have you thing about what culd happend to the AS3 developers or even designers if any other competitor (SL JavaFX) on this market could really provide better solution? GPU acceleration, clear and easy Drawing API with GPU as well, multi threading and efficiency close to the cpp and finally designer/developer-friendly IDE… it would be disaster for Flash platform and huge leak of talented guys.

Because Macromedia/Adobe itself learned us from 10 years how to do better and better stuff.
A lot of guys become developers even if they started from designer background only.
Thanks to this technology and fact that because designer and developer worlds could met in one place.
Is anyone here thinking that designers are going to work so close with pure cpp development as with Flash could do?
Whatever it is, game, website, application. However we still need more because as we can follow the Flash features flash could follow the technology trends around. But in the same time keep it simple and intuitive for us.

Fortunately or not, nor of competitors could change our way … yet. But as we know SL did big storm on this sea few years ago. Think about different scenario. Don’t you thing if someone like Nicolas could develop brand new solution as a platform with this whole stuff above in mind and target to Flash Developers/ Designers? Make it more elegant, efficient and just have a chance avoid all of these bad experience and disappointments in the middle? Is it so difficult? We need another 10 years to promote brand new file extension? Personally I don’t think so. And guy like Nicolas just inspired me to thing this way.
10 years ago was few guys around to play with flash 5. Now we are talking about potentially more than 1milion active development community. If they’ll got something more robust to deal with it will take few months to do revolution and news about this will spread the world as quick as client will be able to pay for new version of Quake on-line with GPU support. And as easy as you can do any stuff in AS3 or haXe. My conclusion is technology and standards are belong to us, developers who can follow or not the trends. If you think is not like that just go backwards 10 years and think what you though about many things, how many technologies died because no one picked it up. Only big companies job is to make you believe is only one way and cover-up the core of the invention. Sometimes is worth to reinvent the wheel.

]]> By: anonymous http://unitzeroone.com/blog/2009/05/22/another-scream-on-flash-alchemy-memory-and-compilers/#comment-690 anonymous Sun, 26 Jul 2009 21:23:45 +0000 http://www.unitzeroone.com/blog/?p=221#comment-690 You have a good point time-wise, politics decides the future of AVM, even though today the relationship seems severed (which is good). And politics is what is actually a bit sad - I mean they hold a leash, however long, to their platform, ready to pull the plug anytime the wind stops blowing into their sail. This is why it took so long for SWF-related tools to pop up - I mean we waited years for a usable SWF specification, and now it is the same story with DoABC tag internals, which is what basically runs the whole platform these days. With Adobe scouting the horizon like the Eye of Sauron, they sure can scare one off even trying, because then one thinks "ah, what the hell, in a year they invent some new flashy thing that they will say is the best thing since sliced bread, and push it on us like sardines on a fish market". Which I am afraid is true too. Which partly mirrors the status quo as you yourself have written about in the above post. Changes come too fast for a scattered community to follow, while the benemoths can actually more than keep up. Not bad as a method of control. You are absolutely right in that sense. You have a good point time-wise, politics decides the future of AVM, even though today the relationship seems severed (which is good). And politics is what is actually a bit sad – I mean they hold a leash, however long, to their platform, ready to pull the plug anytime the wind stops blowing into their sail. This is why it took so long for SWF-related tools to pop up – I mean we waited years for a usable SWF specification, and now it is the same story with DoABC tag internals, which is what basically runs the whole platform these days. With Adobe scouting the horizon like the Eye of Sauron, they sure can scare one off even trying, because then one thinks “ah, what the hell, in a year they invent some new flashy thing that they will say is the best thing since sliced bread, and push it on us like sardines on a fish market”. Which I am afraid is true too. Which partly mirrors the status quo as you yourself have written about in the above post. Changes come too fast for a scattered community to follow, while the benemoths can actually more than keep up. Not bad as a method of control. You are absolutely right in that sense.

]]> By: UnitZeroOne http://unitzeroone.com/blog/2009/05/22/another-scream-on-flash-alchemy-memory-and-compilers/#comment-689 UnitZeroOne Sun, 26 Jul 2009 21:00:49 +0000 http://www.unitzeroone.com/blog/?p=221#comment-689 I do agree to some extent. Problem is that Adobe controls the platform and the languages which target it. Features of the Flash Player, and the API around it are being scaped with ActionScript in mind. Also, with a consectutive release of a new player, the API for AS is in place. Haxe and other languages / compilers targeting the player can only follow up. The way these features are being build is based around ActionScript, not Haxe, not Alchemy. So in terms of native, I do think ActionScript is the first up. Even though other compilers and languages can follow up. That is, until Adobe decides on what to do with what the player actually is targeted by. If they take that wider, then that would change things. But for now, I feel assured that they are taking the path of ActionScript. Gumbo and the effort on the language (MXML could be called a language in this context) don't point to anything else. I do agree to some extent. Problem is that Adobe controls the platform and the languages which target it. Features of the Flash Player, and the API around it are being scaped with ActionScript in mind. Also, with a consectutive release of a new player, the API for AS is in place. Haxe and other languages / compilers targeting the player can only follow up. The way these features are being build is based around ActionScript, not Haxe, not Alchemy.

So in terms of native, I do think ActionScript is the first up. Even though other compilers and languages can follow up. That is, until Adobe decides on what to do with what the player actually is targeted by. If they take that wider, then that would change things. But for now, I feel assured that they are taking the path of ActionScript. Gumbo and the effort on the language (MXML could be called a language in this context) don’t point to anything else.

]]> By: anonymous http://unitzeroone.com/blog/2009/05/22/another-scream-on-flash-alchemy-memory-and-compilers/#comment-688 anonymous Sun, 26 Jul 2009 11:07:16 +0000 http://www.unitzeroone.com/blog/?p=221#comment-688 I disagree with you on "platform's native language" - I don't think AVM2 has any native language, mostly because the gap between the supposed language, ActionScript 3, and the platform, AVM2 is too large - the platform deals with stack, locals, etc, while the language deals with more refined and human-readable logic. haXe would be just as "native" to AVM2, as ActionScript 3. Just because Adobe decided to use ECMAScript flavour to compile into AVM2, does not make it their "native" language or make it AVM2s "native" language. My $.02, of course. I disagree with you on “platform’s native language” – I don’t think AVM2 has any native language, mostly because the gap between the supposed language, ActionScript 3, and the platform, AVM2 is too large – the platform deals with stack, locals, etc, while the language deals with more refined and human-readable logic.

haXe would be just as “native” to AVM2, as ActionScript 3. Just because Adobe decided to use ECMAScript flavour to compile into AVM2, does not make it their “native” language or make it AVM2s “native” language.

My $.02, of course.

]]> By: ryan http://unitzeroone.com/blog/2009/05/22/another-scream-on-flash-alchemy-memory-and-compilers/#comment-687 ryan Mon, 13 Jul 2009 17:05:01 +0000 http://www.unitzeroone.com/blog/?p=221#comment-687 i think i speak for everybody when i say that the biggest drawback to haxe is the lack of developer tools and ide to work with... come on guys... lets change this... i think i speak for everybody when i say that the biggest drawback to haxe is the lack of developer tools and ide to work with… come on guys… lets change this…

]]> By: Victor Dramba http://unitzeroone.com/blog/2009/05/22/another-scream-on-flash-alchemy-memory-and-compilers/#comment-686 Victor Dramba Tue, 07 Jul 2009 19:09:03 +0000 http://www.unitzeroone.com/blog/?p=221#comment-686 Hi, great reading. I also like Haxe as a language. I didn't know that it generates better abc. At one point, you say "it's still not legal to modify the asc.jar and release" Well, that's just what I did with this project http://www.victordramba.com/?p=31 I wonder, will they come after me? :D Hi, great reading. I also like Haxe as a language. I didn’t know that it generates better abc.

At one point, you say “it’s still not legal to modify the asc.jar and release”
Well, that’s just what I did with this project
http://www.victordramba.com/?p=31

I wonder, will they come after me? :D

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